Talk:Auguste Escoffier

Incorrections

introduce discipline and sobriety where before there had been brutality and drunkenness

This line certainly made me smile. Were French kitchens noted for brutal beatings by drunken chefs before Escoffier? The point could surely bear some further development. -- 02 Dec 05.

Rossini died in 1868 and was a friend of Careme. Shouldn't 'Tournedos Rossini go in the Antoine Carême entry? "Let's not forget that the Maestro, a friend of the illustrious chef Marie Antoine Carême, has linked his name to at least five famous dishes: Tournedos Rossini, Cannelloni alla Rossini, Saddle of Veal Rossini, Suprême de Pintade 16 Dec 1993 Rossini, Friand of Chicken Rossini." [1] -Aldo Buzzi in NY Review of Books, 16 Dec 1993. Nice bio nevertheless. Should that 1928 date for the Kaiser's decoration read '1908'? User:Wetman.

My source for the Tournedos Rossini claim was Escoffier On-Line, and it is repeated without proof in other biographies. Here is a facsimile of the relevant page from Ma Cuisine. Escoffier does not say whether he created the recipe or merely recorded it. It may have been created by Careme and Rossini, although this story is usually described as an "anecdote". I shall put in a note saying that the attribution is uncertain. I am fairly sure that the 1928 date is correct: the award was given long after the "emperor of chefs" meeting. -- Heron

"In about 1920, Escoffier became the first chef to receive the Legion of Honour. In 1928 he received the Rosette of an Officer of the Legion from Kaiser William II." How did the ruler of Germany bestow a French decoration? JHCC 19:06, 22 Jun 2004 (UTC)

Definitely wrong. That is a French honor. I think the confusion comes from quotes like: "The French government recognized Escoffier in 1920 by making him a Chevalier of the Legion d' Honneur, and later an Officer in 1928. The honors due Escoffier can be summed up by a quote from Germany's Kaiser Wilhelm II when he told Escoffier, “I am the Emperor of Germany, but you are the emperor of chefs.” " from [[2]] so I'm correcting that statement in the article.

Comment

"brutality" seems a strange word to use about food preparation ... I have substituted "disorder" as seeming more appropriate — Preceding unsigned comment added by Mike hayes (talk • contribs) 22:11, 12 June 2007‎

WikiProject class rating

This article was automatically assessed because at least one article was rated and this bot brought all the other ratings up to at least that level. BetacommandBot 02:26, 27 August 2007 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:Le guide culinaire (1903 Auguste Escoffier book) cover.jpg

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Pic of the old geezer

Lol, just kidding. I was wondering why we don't have an image of Augie. There appears to be some in the German wiki. Is there some reason why we cannot use some of the same images, translating and copying hte rationale and summary over? Or is there an 'internal memo' way of adding the image's use to the English language Wikipedia? - Arcayne (^{cast a spell}) 11:15, 17 November 2007 (UTC)

á la russe vs á la francaise

Who popularised service á la russe, at the expense of á la francaise? Because Wikipedia has articles on both Escoffier and on Carême, which give the credit to both of them. Is that correct; was this change in serving a process, beginning with Carême and finding its fulfillment in Escoffier? Morandir (talk) 05:16, 2 February 2008 (UTC)

Escoffier did, Careme first saw it when he was the chef to Alexander II, but he scoffed at it saying that it would never catch on in the Western world and as such he never fully adopted it.--Chef Christopher Allen Tanner, CCC (talk) 12:16, 2 February 2008 (UTC)

Inquery

Hallo

Do anybody know about a food-exhibition taken place in Paris 1909?

Sitting in Denmark trying to built a museum and therefore we are investigating a local grocer-shop where the owner won first price~gold for the best coffee. But we are unable to locate the place and the document. If anybody can help we will be gratefull.

We know the price was given by Escoffier.

You can find us at www.butiksmuseet.dk - so far only in Danish.

Hope to here from you!

Best regards, Gustav & Kirsten ep@butiksmuseet.dk —Preceding unsigned comment added by 85.81.76.161 (talk) 11:58, 26 January 2009 (UTC)

Near Legendary?

I removed 'near' in the opening description. He is by all means legendary. --Jsderwin (talk) 16:25, 6 September 2009 (UTC)

• Agreed. This article needs a lot of work in general - Escoffier is one of the most important figures in all of gastronomy, and there's barely anything here. I'll try to work on this article as much as I can in the future. Alexthe5th (talk) 22:24, 14 December 2009 (UTC)

Religion

What religious beliefs did Escoffier espouse? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 184.38.77.106 (talk) 19:34, 24 October 2012 (UTC)

Michel Roux, Jr. documentary

The First Master Chef:, the recent BBC documentary by Michel Roux, Jr. included two assertions:

• that Escoffier confessed to the fraud referred to by the article's 2004 reference as unproven
• that Escoffier introduced the "brigade" system, which is not currently mentioned in the article. (Our article Brigade de cuisine also says he did; but has no citation.)

Is the former now generally accepted? Are there better sources? (The documentary is on BBC iPlayer for the next two days, for those of you with access.) Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 21:10, 19 April 2013 (UTC)

A rather late response :) Yes, Escoffier and the others confessed -- I have now cited sources by two different researchers who have seen the confessions, which are apparently in the Savoy's archive. The only justification for the 2004 claim that their misdeeds were "unproven" is that the case never went to court. That's because, eventually, neither side wanted it to go to court. But "unproven" is highly misleading. The confessions were filed, no one disputed them, and the three principals repaid the sums that they were demonstrated to owe.

With the exception that Escoffier alone was allowed to make a token repayment of £500 instead of about £8000. The archives apparently say that this was simply because he hadn't got the money; I guess one might add that bankrupting Escoffier would have been embarrassing for some of the people who knew him well, not least the Prince of Wales (Edward VII). See for example the articles by Paul Levy, cited on the page. Andrew Dalby 12:06, 31 July 2015 (UTC)

New Section- Impact

Right now, this article feels insufficient for the man who essentially invented the modern restaurant. Therefore, I have decided to add a new subheading in this article about Escoffier's impact on food and restaurant culture. I am in the process of writing it, but I welcome any suggestions you all may have about how best to go about this process. I have never written a whole subheading before, and it is going to be fairly extensive, (~1000 words), so any advice would be more than welcome. Michael.holper628 (talk) 08:58, 13 May 2015 (UTC)

King of "chefs"?

Seems weird to translate "cuisinier" to "chef", as the latter is a title and not a job. I know that this is how the press erroneously translated it, but maybe a note on the false equivalence might be okay? "King of cooks and cook of kings" seems to be more faithful to the original meaning in French. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Yoshimatu (talk • contribs) 14:48, 17 February 2021 (UTC)

According to chef, "Many of the titles [used in a kitchen] are based on the brigade de cuisine (or brigade system) documented by Auguste Escoffier". That is pretty interesting and could be included in this article. The only problem with "cook" is it doesn't carry the same authority as chef, in vernacular English. The translators choice of chef is understandable if not technically accurate. -- GreenC 15:49, 17 February 2021 (UTC)

For what it's worth, I agree with @GreenC: on this point. I am aware of the subtleties of the translation, but "chef" is definitely the preferred word in this case. I cook a meal for myself and my family several times a week, and I often make bread and cakes. I consider myself a cook, but in no way am I a chef. To refer to Escoffier as a cook is too greatly underrate his status. Mike Marchmont (talk) 14:40, 7 December 2021 (UTC)

BHM

tell the chef auguste escoffier was firstly established the concept of "haute" cuisine 103.37.80.94 (talk) 19:19, 11 January 2023 (UTC)