Talk:Googoosh

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Rated article[edit]

I've rated this article and provided it a 'B' rating. The article is good enough for being designated as a A-class article but for its numerous "citation needed" tags. I request someone to add more citations. Then, probably, it might be good enough to proceed to the next stage. Thanks! -

14:12, 2 December 2007 (UTC)

Fixed.Tahmasp 17:00, 19 Feb 2008 (UTC)
Actually, it isn't. Just adding connections to Googoosh.com is not the same as providing citations that actually address the statements being cited. See Reliable Sources and Verifiability. That site isn't really the best source, as it is a ghost-authored site where the info can change or be deleted at the drop of a hat. Maybe interviews - articles that are published by magazines, etc. are not subject to change and have the benefit of authors.
Another thing that I am curious about is why there is no mention of her apparent self-confession of depression. This is something that is needed, to give the subject depth, so long as it is well-cited. - Arcayne (cast a spell) 18:44, 19 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]
As it's mentioned on googoosh.com their proposed biography is an Excerption from a BBC interview in 08/06/2000.
And about depression I added a sentence to the text.Tahmasp 22:40, 19 Feb 2008 (UTC)

What was archived[edit]

  • Googoosh is a Persian singer - clarification of Googoosh as a Persian artist, as opposed to Azari.
  • Nationality - contentious continuation of the above discussion. She still appears to be Persian, though.
  • Vandalism - yet more discussion as to the Persian/Azari question, with folk calling others vandals. Wackiness ensues.
  • FA Format - Restructuring the format of the article to more closely resemble those of FA status.
  • Alternate name spellings - disambiguations are created for the different spelling of 'Googoosh'
  • Discography Listings - Reformatting the Discography in line with similar FA articles
  • Filmography Listings - Reformatting the Filmography in line with similar FA articles
  • Images - the removal/replacement of a number of images that the Anti-Decorative Gang of admins hacked up
  • Image context - discussion of better captions for images
  • Lead Statements - removal of endnotes in the Lead.
  • Talk:Googoosh/Archive_1#Sound_files|Sound files]] - The placement of sound files, ie. where best to place them.
  • Red link table - discussion regarding unwikifing those folks without articles.
  • Translation error? - discussion regarding some translation errors, and how to go about correcting them.
  • Googoosh hairstyle - clarification of the Googooshy hairstyle with references

What still needs work[edit]

  • We need to either find references for any statments tagged with 'citation needed' or simply remove the information. There is a higher standard of verifiability, as the article is the biography of a living person. So, thusly tagged, uncited info can be removed by anyone, at any time.
  • There are a lot of wikilinks coming up red (indicating that no articles exist for the link). We might need to un-wikify them. Some enterprising editor could create durable stub articles for the entries, though; even better, translate the Iran wiki articles for these folk into English and start a bunch of articles, including references.
  • some peacock words and unverified peacock statements are creeping back into the article, and we should remain vigilant against that.
  • We still need to find dates for the various album releases. I will ask how to appropriately denote albums that were released in the same year.

We have come a long way. the article is in much better shape than before. :) -Arcayne (cast a spell) 23:33, 29 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Fair use rationale for Image:Googooshx1.jpg[edit]

Image:Googooshx1.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in Wikipedia articles constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.BetacommandBot 16:18, 4 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I couldn't find any proof showing that his image is really an album cover. We can use that image under {{PD-Iran}} or use this or this under {{Non-free magazine cover}} .Arash the Archer 20:12, 5 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I kinda like the look of the first one (I recall seeing a magazine cover license tag for images); it has some text, shows her holding a trophy of some sort and seems to say more than just an image of her (which is the problem of the second picture). I am not sure about this, but is there Wiki policy on actually contacting her representation for free images or images that can be used for free? - Arcayne (cast a spell) 22:49, 5 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Merger Discussions[edit]

Looks like Googoosh discography and Googoosh filmography need to be merged with this article. Any comment? Sidatio 01:17, 6 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I will merge if there are no objections in one week's time. Sidatio 00:29, 7 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]
I think th econcern is that the resulting article would be too long. It seems fien the way it is. - Arcayne (cast a spell) 01:19, 7 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]
See, now I don't think it'd be that much longer - maybe 10-15 lines at the most to accommodate the extra information the Discography article holds. The Filmography section's pretty useless as is - it's more or less a carbon copy of what's found in this article. Still, if we're the only two people who even have an opinion on the topic, maybe we should consider listing on the proposed mergers page if we can't generate more interest. Sidatio 02:03, 7 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Let's try something else first. Put together an edit where the material from the opther page is merged here (essentially your proposal), and then self-revert. I'll take a look at the edit, consult Arash (the other editor who's done loads of work here) and weigh in here. The reason some may have not been weighin in is that I think many of the normal editors are still out of school for the summer, with unsteady internet connections. - Arcayne (cast a spell) 02:12, 7 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Superb idea! I'll put one together tomorrow. Sidatio 02:14, 7 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]
These sub-pages where created to avoid a long list in the main article. I thought the lists might be completed later but since they have not been modified very much (since it is not important to many editors) , it might be better to delete them and only summarize them in the main article. A list of non-English words is not helpful in an English encyclopedia after all. Arash the Archer 10:07, 15 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

(outdent) I agree that it can and should be merged, but the non-English titles are in fact encyclopedic, and should be retained - at least, imho. - Arcayne (cast a spell) 11:07, 15 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

New image[edit]

I just reverted the substitution of an image of Googoosh. The new image can be found here. I think there are several problems with the provenance of the image. to begin with, the image page says that the image came from googoosh.com. While it seems that the image is from a concert in Toronto, the only images currently available on the site are those from her Los Angeles concert. Secondly, I think that these images are not free (and there are some), and are in fact the property of whoever manages Googoosh. Free images trump non-free every single time. If someone wants to find someone who took picturesat a Googoosh concert and upload them to Creative Commons, that would be splendid. Until then, we need to resist the impulse to upload and replace in the article those images of dubious provenance. - Arcayne (cast a spell) 11:52, 2 December 2007 (UTC)[reply]

This is the English language wikipedia[edit]

And that is why Googoosh is printed in English before the Farsi. As well, someone keeps altering dates within the article, without adding references for them. I'd consider it vandalism, but clearly, its the work of a noob without knowledge of the rules. I invite them here to discuss their views and possibly provide citations for their viewpoints. - Arcayne (cast a spell) 09:44, 5 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

dob[edit]

The French and German articles use "Feb. 7, 1951", and our article is switching between "April 15" and "May 5". This page does not currently mention a date. Maybe old versions of that page can help. John Vandenberg (talk) 00:14, 7 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

It would be helpful to find independent sources that unequivocally name the date conclusively, and cite those in the first section following the Lead. Once done, we can point to the citations s to the proper date for Googoosh. - Arcayne (cast a spell) 04:03, 7 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

"Cite error: Invalid tag; refs with no content must have a name"[edit]

These all suddenly appeared, which is why we shouldn't be gathering all of our information from a single source, like a fan site, as the info is likely to change. I am replacing all of the cite error flags with cn tags. Hopefully, someone will roll up their sleeves and find sources to replae them that come from a variety of sources. - Arcayne (cast a spell) 20:10, 7 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Again, this is the English-language Wikipedia[edit]

For the nth time, English spellings dominate here. Someone keeps placing the farsi spelling of her name first in the infobox and elsewhere, and we don't do that here. Perhaps in the Farsi-language wikipedia that can be done, but not here. - Arcayne (cast a spell) 20:10, 7 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Sorr to interrupt you. I did not wrote her name in Persian, but just wanted to remind you that it is not Fars spelling, but the Persian (and for that matter azeri) spelling of her name. I think it is very useful tpo do that because there exist many English spelling while only one spelling is the correct one in the Persian alphabet. BTW: your suage of "Fars" spelling reminds me of something. But never mind--Babakexorramdin (talk) 20:11, 1 June 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Not sure what it reminds you of (unless you consider it a reminder of a typo, which is what it was and has been corrected in this edit). As I do not speak Farsi, I have to rely on the good judgment of people who do. As definition.com refers to Farsi as:
The modern Iranian language, dating from about the ninth century A.D., that is the national language of Iran and is written in an Arabic alphabet; Persian. A native speaker of Farsi.

I am going to go with some ancient Persian alphabet not being notably used int he 21st century. Of course, you might want to consider bringing up that point of discussion on the appropriate page. :) - Arcayne (cast a spell) 05:19, 2 June 2008 (UTC)[reply]

No not that. BTW the correct name is Persian or as you wish the Modern Persian. The usage of Farsi (or worse Fars) has an ethnical connotation and is used by some people with political agenda. It is too often used by ethnonationalists and those who support them.--Babakexorramdin (talk) 10:57, 2 June 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Well, that is certainly not my application, Babak. The English dictionary denotes Farsi as the language or Iran. Therefore, thats the word to be used for it. If you think it should be replaced with 'Persian', then you need to take that matter to guideline or project page to seek a change in the MOS. Until that time, we need to keep using the word "Farsi". In short, just because you derive some negative political connotation with its usage (or some regional grouping does so) does not mean that it is intended here. It's in the dictionary; it is therefore to be used. - Arcayne (cast a spell) 17:54, 2 June 2008 (UTC)[reply]
I think Persian is still used and accepted as the official name. I have viewed many dictionaries.--Babakexorramdin (talk) 23:18, 2 June 2008 (UTC)[reply]

(←dent) okay. Since three different dictionaries don't seem to have hammered the point home by themselves, let's add a few more to that number:

Now, I could go on (and on), but I think the point is made. It isn't what you think or believe that matters here; its what you can prove. As far as all these dictonaries are concerned, Farsi is the language of the Iranian peoples. - Arcayne (cast a spell) 23:30, 2 June 2008 (UTC)[reply]

With all due respect I read in such respectable dictionaries such as Oxford and Webster that Persian is the name of that language.
Farsi might be used today too, but Persian is still in use certainly--Babakexorramdin (talk) 23:35, 2 June 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Those same dictionaries (Oxford and Webster) denote Farsi as the language spoken by Iranian folk. It also denotes that Persian primarily defines those things of Persia. Farsi is the term for the language spoken currently in Iran. As the article is about a person living in modern times, we use the modern term.
Of course, we can try it a different way, Babak; #1: is the Farsi a different language from Persian? - Arcayne (cast a spell) 23:41, 2 June 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Dear Arcayne, I am a complete and total Wiki noob, but I must say I ADORE your comments on this page. 65.51.234.100 (talk) 17:13, 29 January 2016 (UTC)asal[reply]

What is up with the concert dates?[edit]

Look at any FA quality article about a musician, like Selina or Mariah Caey; none of them have listings for concert dates (and in the case of Selina, there would have been more of an argument for inclusion, since she died very early in her career).
I think there might be some misunderstanding about what this article - what Wikipedia - is supposed to do. It is not a fan forum, it is not Ticketmaster, and it is not a useless collection of info (please, anyone, tell me the value and notability of ANY of her past concert dates?). It is against Wiki policy to include it, and were I not at my three edits for the day, I would purge it again. It's enough that the user who keeps adding it in has been reported for violating 3RR. Please use the discussion page to voice your concerns or comments, and not the edit summary. - Arcayne (cast a spell) 21:00, 7 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Fixups[edit]

Without I hope getting involved with the disutes above, I have fixed up the refs to work and dates the cn tags. I am mystified that there were all those """"" s in the article. Rich Farmbrough, 15:41 10 March 2008 (GMT).

Probaby it was due to the overlinkage to a website that re-organized where the articles that were linked and were suddenly orphaned. - Arcayne (cast a spell) 23:20, 10 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

New Album[edit]

I wanted to see if we could add the upcoming release of Googoosh's new album, Shab-e Sepid which will be debuted on March 27, 2008Adam255 (talk) 16:49, 18 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

As per WP:CRYSTAL, I would think that we shouldn't say anything until it actually is being sold. Albums (kind of an idiosyncratic word these days, huh?) are notorious for running into last minute problems that delay release. Also, its important to remember that we are not in a hurry to get the most current info out there; we are not the ones to be cited by news sources. We cite news sources that correspond to one another. I realize that since Googoosh isn't always on the music radar in the English-speaking world, finding citations about her is a royal pain in the bum. Try seeing it the other way: how widespread is the coverage of western music in the Farsi-language wiki? As Googoosh increases in popularity in the West, there will be more people writing about her. Pretty soon, we are going to be faced with tons of teenaged vandals fresh out of middle school vandalizing her article coz' she's so popular. :P - Arcayne (cast a spell) 20:59, 18 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Ok, well the album is officially out! It's Googoosh and Mehrdad - Shab-e Sepid!Adam255 (talk) 04:52, 1 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

GooGoosh Name[edit]

Hi, I believe that Googoosh name is not absolutly Armneian name, it shoudl be a Azerbaijani name. Because Goo in Azeribaijani Language is "Swan" and Goosh in Azeri is "Bird", hence GooGoosh should be Swanbird. Thus it is nothing to do with Armenian langauge. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 85.145.221.35 (talk) 11:36, 30 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I believe the heritage of the name has been discussed ad infinitum, with one ethnic group or another trying to claim her as solely theirs. It's pretty unimportant to the topic. It would be like trying to claim that Bill Clinton or Hillary Swank are who they are because of their name's ethnicity, and that of course, is utterly preposterous. - Arcayne (cast a spell) 17:49, 30 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]
I do not see the problem here. Gugush is an Iranian Azeri. This is something which all her biographies tell. I do not understand why yoiu are disputing that?--Babakexorramdin (talk) 20:13, 1 June 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Please re-read my dissent, Babak - I don't care where she is from, so long as it is reliably, notably and verifiably cited. o one has managed to do that as of yet, and the clownish back and forth is tedious. When someone provides a citation that meets Wikipedia's citeria, then it can stay. Without it, it stays out. - Arcayne (cast a spell) 05:13, 2 June 2008 (UTC)[reply]
What you are doing is stating that googoosh lived in the republic of Azerbaijan, prior to her resident in tehran. This is wrong and I you cannot find citations for that. What I and others are saying is that Although Googoosh is born in Tehran Her father lived in the Iranian Azerbaijan (Sarab. This is the Iranian region of Azerbaijan and not the republic of Azerbaijan.--Babakexorramdin (talk) 10:59, 2 June 2008 (UTC)[reply]
By Azerbaijan, Iranian Azerbaijan is meant, not the republic. --Kurdo777 (talk) 12:53, 2 June 2008 (UTC)[reply]
You know this and I know this, but Arcayne did not refer to the Iranian Azerbaijan! That is the problem. (S)he needs a source which says that she is from the Iranian Azerbaijan and not from the republic of Azerbaijan. I think there are plenty of them any way. But there is no sources which confirms Arcayne's POV.--Babakexorramdin (talk) 16:55, 2 June 2008 (UTC)[reply]
First of all, Babak, you have already been advised to leave the unflattering assumptions at the door. Please do us both the kindness of not pretending to know what my POV is; there is no vast dark conspiracy to fuck anyone over or, if there is, I am certainly not a part of it. You are going to find me a far more willing participant in discussions if you avoid categorizing me as a bad guy. I tend to get a bit unpleasant when someone does that.
Secondly of all, we need citations to assert her ethnicity beyond Iranian. I know it is some big deal over there where the heck you are from, but please keep in mind that this is the English-language wikipedia; that sort of editing behavior by one ethnic group or another to claim her as one of their own is often seen as parochial and backwards. I am sorely tempted to simply remove any claim of Googoosh's ethnicity (beyond that of being Iranian), and unless someone brings some reliably solid and verifiable sources that further subdivide her ethnic background, I will likely do that by week's end. If you find this relatively benign ultimatum to be unfair, I would encourage anyone to seek out the opinion of an admin, or seek a request for comment, which will bring some neutral eyes to the matter (at least, more neutral than we are seeing now).
in the Iranian context, Azerbaijan is meant as Iranian Azerbaijan which is what the source is taking about, not the country to the north.--Kurdo777 (talk) 17:30, 2 June 2008 (UTC)[reply]
With respect, I do not care a bit what the "Iranian context" is. The citation needs to specifically note her ethnicity. If it doesn't do that, find another citation. If you cannot find a citation, you cannot include it.
As well, you are going to need to learn how to use discussion better, Kurdo. This is the second article I have encountered you in where you all too willing to edit-war. The next time it occurs here, you will be reported. I have tried the carrot in appealing to you to discuss your edits. Please do not force me to utilize the stick. - Arcayne (cast a spell) 17:35, 2 June 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Dear Arcayne, no one here is calling you a bad guy. I am not concerned really about Googoosh's ethnicity, and I think that Kurdo is not concerned either. What we are saying is that you say that you mentioned Azerbaijan. This is confusing because the country to the North of Iran is called the republic of Azerbaijan, whiole the Northwestern part of Iran is called also Azerbaijan. What we are saying is that we make a better conclusion in order to avoid confusion. Do you see it now? --Babakexorramdin (talk) 23:25, 2 June 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Babak, I do understand the confusion in regions - a similar confusion exists in the States, where there are at least two Kansas Cities, and in the UK, don't even get me started on how many towns are identically named (it makes travel there oh-so-fun). while I think it is an important distinction to make in the article, I think it is vital or us to cite the ethnicity question so we can even add the point of clarification. If we cannot cite her as being Azer, then there is no point in even mentioning the confusion between same-name places. :) - Arcayne (cast a spell) 23:39, 2 June 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Marriage[edit]

Is she still married to Kimlai or not? Kurdo was insisting (everywhere but here) that they must be divorced, noting the uncited statement that he hasn't ever left Iran, while Googoosh left for the US. We have citations for their marriage since at least 2000 through both CNN and her own website. I have pointed out on numerous occasions how a WP:BLP needs citations for any new or contentious information. If they are in fact divorced, we need a citation that says that. If she is an Azerbaijani, we need a citation for that as well (and perhaps an Azer propagandist site isn't really the best place to look for neutrality here). I welcome more discussion on this topic.- Arcayne (cast a spell) 20:27, 2 June 2008 (UTC)[reply]

As we have a citation that states quite clearly that the two are married, it stays. It is reiterated on Googoosh's own website. If someone feels that they aren't, due to the geographic distance separating them, then please provide a citation noting their divorce (as I - and presumably the editor who keeps reverting out the marriage as "outdated" - haven't been able to find mention of one). BLP requires us to add timely, relevant and correct information in an article about a living person. The statement about her marriage is cited and - until proven otherwise - accurate. As well, the information is not hurtful to the subject, so I am of the opinion that removing it is a synthesis violation of our no original research policy (to whit, the assumption that she is divorced because her marriage was in 2000 and they are not currently living together). - Arcayne (cast a spell) 07:26, 4 June 2008 (UTC)[reply]
I changed the marriage sentence to say, She married director Masoud Kimiai in the early 1990s. and sourced it to iranian.com. As a statement about the event of the marriage rather than her current (undetermined) marital status, what do we think about this? CIreland (talk) 10:47, 4 June 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Sure, I can live with this, though I still think that any speculation as to her current marriage status is just that: speculation. - Arcayne (cast a spell) 16:32, 4 June 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Removals of large portions of the article[edit]

I have removed large amounts of text from this article. A few I removed as unsourced and potentially controversial statements in a biography. Most of the removals were done because the text was lifted verbatim from a number of sources and hence had obvious copyright issues. I hope I got all the stolen text, but someone may wish to double check what remains. CIreland (talk) 11:42, 3 June 2008 (UTC)[reply]

While some of the information removed seems to be valuable info that could have been used, we cannot take text written by someone else verbatim and use it here. Any number of reasons could explain the plagiarism, but none are acceptable. Any new information added from this point forward will be checked to ensure that this doesn't happen again. - Arcayne (cast a spell) 16:58, 3 June 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Arcayne, it is cited, just look under the next source:
"Googoosh was born Faegheh Atashin in 1951 on Sarcheshmeh Street, in an old and worn down part of Tehran, to Azerbaijani immigrant parents from the former Soviet Union." [1] Parishan (talk) 21:41, 29 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Is there even the slightest of reliably-sourced citations outside of this fansite? The pages there keep getting purged, leaving us with crap links. I am not saying I doubt the info, but because there is a ton of pov concerned with ethnicity in that particular part of the world, its going to last a LOT longer if it is more reliably cited to a stable source. - Arcayne (cast a spell) 17:31, September 29, 2008 (UTC)

Googoosh' birthdate[edit]

I've been noticing a number of insertions of alternate dates of birth for the performer. I have recently reverted out an uncited DOB, asking for a reliable source citation noting the birthdate. So far, that hasn't happened, and yet the date keps getting reverted. Can someone bring a citation here that reliable, verifiably proves the woman's birthdate? - Arcayne (cast a spell) 06:31, 31 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Signatory or not?[edit]

The question is did she or did she not sign - here on line #95 of the "New Signatories" section. As evidence consider:

the signup process. It requires email confirmation.
the notability of other signatures - with press releases and news coverage. This is not an obscure process see - arrests of the leadership.

additionally I am contacting the website maintainers for specifics about their justification of the signatures. I suspect they also have to keep confidential any contact information. Smkolins (talk) 16:27, 3 March 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I appreciate the efforts, Smkolins. As you might be aware, there are folk out there who are not necessarily very honest when they create email accounts. I could set up an account for Googoosh myself at Yahoo, Excite, Gmail or any on of a hundred sites - all of which could be verified as being valid email addresses, but none of which are actually owned by the performer. As you noted that there might be news coverage of this petition, there might be confirmation from Googoosh' press personnel that she did indeed sign the petition. I think it unlikely, as very few performers are ever going to reveal their private email accounts to the public. Thoughts? - Arcayne (cast a spell) 17:24, 3 March 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I do see that things could be faked but hope to hear more from the website itself about the details of their process and checks. They have other high profile signatures so should have something in place. I don't know if Googoosh has a website for such but perhaps I or you or others can find it and check and or email through them with links to check and ask them to post something official so we don't have to rely on emails for substantiation. I went ahead and left a note at www.googoosh.com asking for public commentary on if it is her signature. :-) Smkolins (talk) 23:42, 3 March 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I received a reply from we-are-ashamed.com which says in part "Mrs. Atashin used her official email adress to sign the letter. We contacted her and asked her to make a statement about it. I have just published the Persian version of her response. The English translation will follow soon." I'm attempting to identify it - you may want to check in this area or here. Smkolins (talk) 12:54, 4 March 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I don't know about you, but I would be a lot more comfortable if we had independent confirmation; BLP requires it for something that is potentially controversial. Since it is so newsworthy, maybe there is a news story about it. I am not convinced that a petition site is all that reliable. I remember reading about a petition to feed starving children that someone added a lot of prominent political names to it. The political folk couldn't argue against the unauthorized usage of their names; who wants to say they are against feeding starving kids? Unless we have it from an official news outlet, we shouldn't use it. - Arcayne (cast a spell) 14:30, 4 March 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I am aiming for that comfort zone but I'm willing to work with websites to improve their reputation if that's what they want. The website has approached the matter along those lines and the subject matter is not one easily tuned towards flippancy. Official news outlets are hardly the limit of verifiable sources though I recall the need of independent confirmation for people still living. Thus I've asked at googoosh.com. I feel wikipedia editors like to improve quality simply by deleting rather than doing the work of actually improving the content by adding good content. That's what I'm trying to do. I appreciate being informed where we like the line to be on good content. I appreciate even more the elbow grease to get that information. So far the ashamed website has been trying to make it so. They've even asked for a review of all hits of any names matching their list for review - they maintain the first two of the lists are highly verified but I've pointed out they haven't said how. I suggested they contact a reputable newspaper and have a reporter do a story. The third section they've only done bare checks and Googgoosh is in that section though they also say they've had an exchange of emails with that entry writer and are working on a public statement. Smkolins (talk) 18:43, 4 March 2009 (UTC)[reply]

We need citations[edit]

I am a little concerned over the edit summary comment that "I agree with the bad writing however the part of her and mestaghi and her and kimiai separating is a well known fact is you are iranian which you are not arcayne!)" My concern arises fore three reasons.
First, what nationality I am doesn't matter; if something is "well-known" only within one ethnic group, then it should be apparent that background needs to be provided when writing for a group outside of that ethnicity. I am not lending credence to this assertion, and think its bad no matter how you look at it.
Secondly, This background needs to be in the form of adequate citation. Anyone even halfway familiar with this article is aware that the occasionally added claim that Googoosh is of Azeri extraction. These edits are never offered with sources that meet Wikipedia's reliability and verifiability criteria for inclusion. The same is true of the slew of additions that followed the aforementioned edit.
Thirdly, Googoosh.com is quite frankly an awful website to cull info from. There is little in the way of editorial oversight and anything approaching verifiable continuity. No facts offered there are verifiable, and almost every bit of information offered there vanishes within a week or two. Because of this apparently chronic instability, we cannot use Googoosh.com as a secondary source of references for this article. We need to find sources outside of Googoosh to use to cite the statements in the article. If no citations exist, we tag them. If they are challenged, they have to be removed until they can be proven by reliable references.
To that end, I am again purging the article of many of the references from Googoosh.com. When an alternative source is found, we can move forward. - Arcayne (cast a spell) 10:45, 10 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I'd also point out that we simply do not need two infoboxes for this subject. Jennifer Lopez, who wears a great many more hats than Googoosh, and yet only has (and only needs) one infobox. Someone keeps adding a superfluous one in. - Arcayne (cast a spell) 23:49, 10 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I think we need reliable sources that provide the number of hats worn by each of these two artists.--Ff11 (talk) 05:53, 19 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]
You do understand that I am not actually talking about hats, right? It's an expression, used to denote a person with a number of job titles. - Arcayne (cast a spell) 19:59, 19 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Just trying to point out the POV in your comment. I don't think it is a given that Jennifer Lopez wears more hats, has had more job titles, or is more accomplished in any way. In fact I would suggest the opposite.--Ff11 (talk) 01:35, 20 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Not even in the neighborhood of my point, Ff11. The fact is, we do not need two infoboxes for the subject. The example of Lopez was provided to indicate how another female singer who does more than just sing doesn't need multiple infoboxes. Neither does Googoosh.
And I'll neatly sidestep your comment about the relative skills of each performer. Your opinions are just that - yours. - Arcayne (cast a spell) 05:51, 20 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I agree, the point I was making is that just like mine, your opinions are also just that - yours. Neither has any place in Wikipedia. You may want to be more careful in the future. Also, last I checked, both pages had multiple info boxes.--Ff11 (talk) 18:33, 20 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I am confused; what opinions was I offering as policy? I wasn't aware that I was doing such. Also, you might want to check again; J-Lo's page has a single infobox in it. You are not confusing an infobox (which is at the top right of the article) with a table, are you? - Arcayne (cast a spell) 21:43, 20 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Good lord, I hate to take up Wikipedia space with this discussion. You are correct, I was referring to tables, but they both have only one infobox if it is the one at the top right. The other point was that the statement "Jennifer Lopez, who wears a great many more hats than Googoosh ..." is pure opinion. Saying no article, or artist bio should have multiple info boxes is one thing (and a fair comment), making subjective rankings of artists is another. I didn't really expect a drawn out discussion.--Ff11 (talk) 02:43, 21 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Nor did I; I am sorry if you thought I was rendering an opinion. Jennifer Lopez is currently an actress, singer, record producer, dancer, fashion designer and television producer. Does Googoosh' activities also fulfill all these occupations? As I hadn't seen any citations to that effect, it prompted my response that if J-Lo - who was involved in more career paths - didn't have multiple infoboxes, it didn't seem necessary to do such for someone who was less involved. That was my point, and I am sorry if me being somehow vague confused you on my meaning. - Arcayne (cast a spell) 02:59, 21 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Tried to cite article, but my attempt failed[edit]

Help!!, I first added the whole ref here, but nothing showed removed start and end of ref.

New York Times.com>{{cite web|title=Iranian Exiles Rally at U.N. for Release of Prisoners|url=http://www.nytimes.com/2009/07/23/world/middleeast/23iran.html?ref=global-home%7Caccessdate = 2009-07-22

Atmamatma (talk) 06:24, 23 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]


Okay, the cite web template can be found here. As a matter of personal prference, I like to use the moderately extensive "Using author and authorlink (with current date)", unless there is more than one author. Doing so, and plugging in the date from the linked article, it should look like this (go to the edit page screen to see the mechanics of this):
  • Neil MacFarquharm (22 July 2009). "Iranian Exiles Rally at U.N. for Release of Prisoners". Middle East. New York Times. Retrieved 23 July 2009. {{cite web}}: Text "accessdate" ignored (help)
Now, add a <ref> before and a </ref> after that (don't forget the latter forward slash mark, or everything will get cocked up), and you are done. There are a ton of citation templates you can yuse here, like cite news, cite book, cite journal, etc. I'll put a link on your page that will show you how to develop the "muscles" you will need to develop as a wiki editor.
Of course, the lazy fellow (which often includes me) will sometimes just put the link within the start ref and end ref bracketing, like so:
This will have to be formatted later and ideally, you'd be the one to do it. - Arcayne (cast a spell) 15:15, 23 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

File:Googooshchildhood2.jpg Nominated for Deletion[edit]

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File:Googoosh 01.jpg Nominated for Deletion[edit]

An image used in this article, File:Googoosh 01.jpg, has been nominated for deletion at Wikimedia Commons in the following category: Deletion requests January 2012
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salam[edit]

salam man amir tabriz hastam age eftekhar bedin akhrin akse rozetono mikham

  1. REDIRECT [[File:Target page name]] — Preceding unsigned comment added by 46.100.134.79 (talk) 08:11, 13 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Awards[edit]

There was a citation for Googoosh winning the Sanremo Music Festival in Italy as "best artist of the year" in 1973, however I reviewed the citation that was provided and there is no mention of her winning this award. I tried to find this information elsewhere online and found various sources that basically cite that she participated in Sanremo in 1973 and recorded two albums but she did not win any awards. If you can find a proper citation showing she won the "best artist of the year" in 1973, please feel free to update the article and include the new citation. But until then I am rewriting the sentence to show she participated in Sanremo Music Fest only. Jooojay (talk) 07:15, 10 October 2014 (UTC)[reply]

External links modified[edit]

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External links modified[edit]

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Add come back Performance Melbourne Victoria Australia[edit]

Add come back Performance Melbourne Victoria Australia 211.30.9.76 (talk) 22:38, 23 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

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