Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Accessory Before the Act

This page is an archive of the discussion about the proposed deletion of the article below. This page is no longer live. Further comments should be made on the article's talk page rather than here so that this page is preserved as an historic record.
The result of the debate was redirect. Mindspillage (spill yours?) 03:57, 4 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Accessory Before the Act[edit]

Delete. Dicdef, and not an accurate one - this isn't really a legal term. Tufflaw 06:04, May 21, 2005 (UTC)

Delete, dictionary definition. Megan1967 06:15, 21 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]
Redirect to Accomplice —Wahoofive (talk) 15:58, 21 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]
- P.S. The Accomplice article mentions accessories and has a link to Accessory, which is a German rock band. —Wahoofive (talk) 16:00, 21 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]
  - Good catch - The Accomplice article had some major inaccuracies which I removed, so no more link to Deutschland rockers. Tufflaw 03:28, May 23, 2005 (UTC)
Delete. There is already a word that refers to someone who is an accesory before the act (of a crime) and that is "conspirator" or "co-conspirator." --Fazdeconta 16:17, 21 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]
This was a legal term, certainly in England. It is now probably an historical relict, but I vould vote for re-direct to Accomplice in case someone find this term in an older book and needs to know what it means. --Simon Cursitor 07:45, 23 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]
This was at one time an important legal term, and still is in some jurisdictions, i think. It is not identical with "conspirator". Howver the current articel is inaccurate and incomplete. Keep and rewrite. DES 17:29, 26 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]

I have created the pages Accessory (legal term) and Accessory (disambiguation) and moved the old Accessory page to Accessory (band). I have also fixed the appropriate links. I would like to make Accessory Before the Act into a simple redirect to Accessory (legal term), which now fully explains accesories both before and after the act, and how they differ from accomplices and conspiritors. I didn't actually make the change to a redirect, because I am not sure if this violates the rule against "moving or blanking" the page on the VfD list, but I did edit it to leave only a see link to Accessory (legal term). DES 16:56, 27 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]

It should specify where this is considered a legal term, if at all (someone said England?) This isn't a term used in the United States at all that I am aware of (I've been practicing criminal law for six years and I've never heard that term used). Tufflaw 20:40, May 27, 2005 (UTC)

I think that in the US the term is mostly of historical interest, and it was always more common in the UK and the commonwealth. A current refernce seems to indiacte that it is still in use in New Zealand. Even in the UK I think the terms "before the act" and "after the act" are now less commonly used they they were 50-150 years ago. I can't offhand documet specifc dates of usage. Do you mean that the redirect page should specify usage, or that this page should not be a simple redirect? or do you mean that the page on Accessory (legal term), should include this information? I would tend to favor the latter. DES 21:04, 27 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]

I have added a note towards the end of Accessory (legal term), in an attempt to clarify usage. I hope this deals with User:Tufflaw's issue. DES 22:43, 27 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Comment User:Tufflaw said that "this isn't really a legal term" and "I've been practicing criminal law for six years and I've never heard that term used". Here is a list of references that define or use the term, including current statutes from two US States, and legal proceedings and model jury instructions from others, as well as a quote from Blackstone for historical usage. Perhaps this is enough to indicate that this is indeed a legal term.

Hmm.. Guess I was wrong, although I never heard this term in law school or ever in any of the jurisdictions I've worked in. I would note that the article title is for "act" and not "fact", but regardless good job on finding all that stuff. I think this should still be deleted insomuch as it's still the wrong title. I'll create Accessory Before the Fact and Accessory After the Fact and redirect to the new Accessory page in case anyone is looking for those specific terms. Tufflaw 05:04, May 28, 2005 (UTC)

I wouldn't argue with that outcome. DES 13:58, 28 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]

This page is now preserved as an archive of the debate and, like some other VfD subpages, is no longer 'live'. Subsequent comments on the issue, the deletion, or the decision-making process should be placed on the relevant 'live' pages. Please do not edit this page.