Talk:Gang of Four

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2008 election[edit]

I've heard quite frequently of Kerry, Dean, Gore, and Kennedy being referred to as a Gang of Four with regards to the 2008 election. Do y'all fell this merits inclusion? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 129.120.244.86 (talk) 21:58, 19 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

No, definitely not. Never even heard that phrase. --GwydionM (talk) 07:29, 20 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Bias>[edit]

Arcticle is ludicrously biased. Gang of 4 were clearly in power and responsible for Cultural Revolution - with their line, not Deng's, dominant at 10th congress. Opponents of CR overthrew them following Mao's death. Ridiculous for those who organized that coup to pretend they were suppressing an "abortive attempt to gain power" and even more ridiculous for outsiders to accept that account.

But in 1973 the Gang of Four is still not dominating, especially after the death of Lin Biao. They only seized much power in 1975, when they tried to attack Zhou Enlai.--Formulax 01:40 21 Jun 2003 (UTC)

Wait, wait. The article contains links to other Gang of Fours. Are you planning to do disambiguate? Taku 02:38 Jan 4, 2003 (UTC)

This article is not detailed enough. Colipon 20:00, 3 Sep 2003 (UTC)

This article, as of June 5, 2004, is still extremely confusing. There are simply too many red herrings.

Italicized portions are what I think are red herrings which simply throw people off the proper line of thought. Two or three might be fine for underlining; too many makes this confusing. They should, properly, belong to respective articles, not here. An example (extract):

The removal of this group from power marked the end of the Cultural Revolution, which had been launched by Mao in 1966 as part of his power struggle with leaders such as Liu Shaoqi, Deng Xiaoping and Peng Zhen. Jiang, who before 1966 had not taken a public political role, was placed in charge of the country's cultural apparatus by Mao. Zhang, Yao and Wang were party leaders in Shanghai who had played leading roles in capturing that city for Mao. The military leader Lin Biao was also part of this group until his sudden and never fully explained death in 1971.
"After Lin's death, the Cultural Revolution, which had reduced China's economy, cultural life and educational system to chaos, began to lose impetus. The new commanders of the People's Liberation Army demanded that order be restored in light of the dangerous situation along the border with the Soviet Union (see Sino-Soviet split). The Premier, Zhou Enlai, who had gone along with the Cultural Revolution but never fully supported it, regained his authority, and used it to bring Deng Xiaoping back into the Party leadership at the 10th Party Congress in 1973. (Liu Shaoqi had died in prison in 1969.)

What do they explain about Gang of Four after all? Mandel 12:46, Jun 5, 2004 (UTC)

The vilification of the "Gang" served a useful purpose for the Deng regime. It provided a useful scapegoat for all that had gone wrong with Chinese Communism since 1959, without undermining the fundamental legitimacy of the regime by assigning blame for catastrophic events like the Great Leap Forward and the Cultural Revolution where it properly belonged, with Mao Zedong himself.
Mao was to blame but his most trusted underlings weren't to be blamed at all? That's like saying if the Allies caught Adolf Hitler, Hitler would be hanged but his loyal underlings Himmler, Goebbels, Goering, Hess, Borman, Mengele and Eichmann ought to be let go and be set free of all charges.

This needs to be rewritten. Chinese historography after DXP gained power in 1978 puts most of the blame for the GLF and the cultural revolution on Mao himself, and I don't think that anyone in China has ever argued that the Gang of Four had anything to do with the Great Leap Forward.

Now one can make the argument that the villification of the Gang of Four allowed Deng to soften his criticism of Mao between 1976 and 1978 when it was necessary for him to consolidate power, but that's a different statement.

Roadrunner 07:09, 18 Sep 2004 (UTC)

Also removed show trial for NPOV reasons.

Roadrunner 07:15, 18 Sep 2004 (UTC)

The use of "coup" here is simply incorrect, even going by the account given here. Why has this not been corrected? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.73.12.76 (talk) 12:08, 3 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Stupid question[edit]

But how do you ######### "Pinyin si4 ren2 bang1"? The numbers look like vandalism to me, or is it not? btw, why does the disambiguation page of Gang of four point to here? - Henk Poley

It wasn't vandalism. The numbers represent the tones.

Picture... too big[edit]

Could someone resize it or shuffle the pictures around so that it actually fits in a standard browser screen? — Ambush Commander(Talk) 14:58, August 14, 2005 (UTC)

I find that the picture (vertical display) of the Gang of Four has a problem with the display of the names in my browser. In particular, the name of Jiang Qing is displayed on my browser as 'Jiana Qina', presumably because the bottom of the letters has been truncated. Does anyone know how to fix this? Bill Jefferys 01:40, 27 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]

This site and its links may be monitored[edit]

22.10.05 This site was referred to in the Wikipedia daily article (Oct. 6) so whilst in Shanghai last week I accessed it (and a number of the links) from a private ADSL line. The next day I could not access Wikipedia or Wikiquote at all (temporarily unavailable...). That evening the gendarmerie knocked on the door in a belligerent mood to check my credentials. I've been to China several times, this is the first time I've received an official visit. I have read somewhere that net surfing is closely monitored in China by a large number (one recent article said 30,000) of police. I believe it

Heck, I couldn't even access Wikipedia last month when I visited China! InvictaHOG 20:34, 30 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Lack of citations[edit]

Should the lack of citations tag not be at the top of the article, as there are no references throughout?-Hornandsoccer 01:07, 15 April 2006 (UTC)[reply]


Khmer Rouge[edit]

Giving a link to Khmer Rouge with parantheseses saying similar practices is highly POV. Firstly there is no links to this and no evidence provided, no are the practices of tha "Gang of Four" or any others with the Cultural Revolution Group similar to the practices of Khmer Rouge. In fact the historical circumstances of both are so QUITE different that such a link can't be made.

Added some references[edit]

Lin Biao was the rival of Madam Mao, and the Gang of Four probably only formed after his death. Chen Boda's position is disputed.

I added some references and a detailed account of their arrest. Also split into sections. --GwydionM 17:47, 14 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Is it OK to remove the 'no reference' tag? If no one objects, I will do it this time next month. --GwydionM 18:20, 16 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Could we add a section about Mao?[edit]

After reading this the average reader, with some prior knowledge of Mao Zedong, may question whether this gang of four was just a way to shield Mao from being blamed for the Cultural Revolution. Undoubtedly the gang of four played a part but how much? Perhaps someone could talk more about this or add a little more information about Mao and his role in the Cultural revolution. Or perhaps there really isn't enough information to make these claims either way... —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.208.228.193 (talk) 21:05, 12 October 2007 (UTC)[reply]

redirect[edit]

We could use a page to let folks easily find both the band and the software design pattern team as well. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 216.163.80.138 (talk) 18:33, 14 March 2008 (UTC) (nevermind, it's under Gang of Four (disambiguation)...[reply]

The disambiguation page is there, but I found it by searching "gang of four band" - but a search for gang of four goes straight to this page. Flickharrison (talk) 21:10, 7 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

That's because Gang of Four is a historical significant term. It would be like Stonehenge. If people typed in Stonehenge, they should go to Stonehenge and not some disambiguation for a software program or some band, which may not even be remembered or known of in the future. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.57.61.26 (talk) 22:29, 26 February 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Aftermath[edit]

For consideration: Immediately after the coup d’etat, Hua Guofeng, Marshall Ye Jianying and economic czar Li Xiannian formed the core of the party leadership. These three, together with the newly rehabilitated Deng Xiaoping and bodyguard cum coup leader Wang Dongxing were elected party Vice Chairmen at the August 1977 11th National Party Congress. At the politburo level, the membership of all four living marshals, 7 other generals and at least five others with close military ties reflects the deep concern for national stability. DOR (HK) (talk)

I'd see it as the sort of thing we want, assuming the details are accurate. A named source would be nice.--GwydionM (talk) 17:04, 2 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks. Done, with minor changes. DOR (HK) (talk) 06:34, 5 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Cheers. I fixed a link - most individual Congresses don't currently have pages, though they would be worth adding. --GwydionM (talk) 11:38, 5 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Influence on naming[edit]

Should mention that this has had international influence (like "Mother of all battles" etc.); here are Wikipedia articles: AnonMoos (talk) 19:44, 16 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]

I agree, you should post it. But I'd suggest putting it on fewer lines, e.g. Gang of Four (band), Gang of Four (game), Gang of Four (Harlem). --GwydionM (talk) 18:42, 17 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]

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Odd wording[edit]

"The Gang of Four effectively controlled the power organs of the Communist Party of China" What is a "power organ"? I get the gist of the sentence, but I've never heard of and can't find this phrase anywhere else. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 134.60.115.152 (talk) 07:32, 1 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

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Unclear Motives[edit]

This article's introduction is very seriously flawed because it doesn't explain what the Gang of Four hoped to accomplish through their politicking. Reading through the article, I still don't quite understand. --Lunatic, Esquire (talk) 10:04, 16 January 2018 (UTC)[reply]

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Numerology[edit]

I am surprised that this article didn't mention that Chinese numbers have meanings, and that the number 4 is associated with death. You cannot, for example, find a fourth floor or a fourth room in a Chinese hotel. The Gang of Four had more than four members. Using the number, and identifying four leaders, was a device closely connected to the negative meaning of the number 4 in Chinese. Similarly, the number 8 means abundance. The Beijing Olympics began on August 8, 2008. Not by mistake. All that said, I'm not going to make any change because Wikipedia is pretty much a mess full of edit wars, so I'll confine this to a comment here rather than put up with the craziness. 2605:59C8:47E:4210:48CF:F59F:B4CF:F164 (talk) 02:14, 30 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

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