Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/StickHorsie

This page is an archive of the discussion about the proposed deletion of the article below. This page is no longer live. Further comments should be made on the article's talk page rather than here so that this page is preserved as an historic record.
The result of the debate was delete. Mindspillage (spill yours?) 21:14, 6 May 2005 (UTC)

StickHorsie

Non-notable Internet meme. The Stargate story mentioned is a fanfiction story, not a TV episode. Gazpacho 12:15, 23 Apr 2005 (UTC)

• Image:01-horsie.gif has since been deleted. Master Thief Garrett 22:02, 23 Apr 2005 (UTC)
  • And it's been speedied at Commons too. Good; the author didn't intend to release it under the GFDL, and it's good to have those cases gone quickly. --SPUI (talk) 22:27, 23 Apr 2005 (UTC)
• Delete, weak reference to (another?) fanfic, useless joke thing. Master Thief Garrett 12:37, 23 Apr 2005 (UTC)

  But what a great fanfiction story it is! - Stickhorsie supporter. (comment by 144.131.27.23)

  Great or not great, fanfiction is only notable in exceptional circumstances. Sorry, but I will have to say delete. Sjakkalle 12:31, 23 Apr 2005 (UTC)

• Never said it was a TV episode, did I? :/

And I'm just trying to get the original graphic deleted which is NOT a JOKE IMAGE but shouldn't have been put on Wikipedia. Just google "StickHorsie" (name or image) and you'll see it's NOT a joke image or anything useless. (comment by article author DarkSkywise)

• Delete I dunno what Google you're using, but when I try to Google "StickHorsie" I get just 11 web hits (mostly forums) and 4 image matches. Exactly what constitues a "joke" or "useless" is in the eye of the beholder, I suppose, but such wretched Google results suggest that this extremely minor-league meme isn't wikiworthy. Andrew Lenahan - Starblind 13:51, Apr 23, 2005 (UTC)

Most of the 200-plus Horsie graphics (with lots by famous web artists) are just labeled "Horsie-something" so you would get just a few. And in older stories it was just "Stick Horsie" and not "StickHorsie". I only mentioned Google because it would at least yield a few pics the easy way.

But apart form that I'm trying to get the image deleted, not restored (and one of these forums is the 5th largest in the world... that should count for something). 80.57.233.10 14:49, 23 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Also, another of those forums is the largest help group in MSN which currently has 30,022 members and increasing in size constantly.

• Delete, maybe BJAODN. If the horsie is truly "copyright-free", then we can include it on the BJAODN page. --SPUI (talk) 15:10, 23 Apr 2005 (UTC)

No it's not, it's ™ since 2003... PLEASE do NOT restore, REMOVE. 80.57.233.10 15:15, 23 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Now for 5 straight hours, costing me a LOT of money so far, I've been JUST trying to get this image deleted just like Master Thief Garrett said it should be anyway, but instead everybody keeps restoring it. I'm sorry, I REALLY don't get it!

DarkSkywise

It is Wikipedia policy, articles, unless they are total nonsense (e.g. random letters) or such, can be deleted only after a week of voting, and during that voting article should stay intact, that is, no parts should be deleted; or it might be improved by adding more parts and that way possibly changing the decition in it. So the image as well as article, if everyone or the majority will vote delete, will be deleted after a week, and up till then it should stay with image. DeirYassin 16:23, 23 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Did everbody die out there just to annoy me? :-/

Picture seems to be gone now, cobber.

Nope, still there, even after Ctrl-F5 :-S

It is Wikipedia policy, articles, unless they are total nonsense (e.g. random letters) or such, can be deleted only after a week of voting, and during that voting article should stay intact, that is, no parts should be deleted; or it might be improved by adding more parts and that way possibly changing the decition in it. So the image as well as article, if everyone or the majority will vote delete, will be deleted after a week, and up till then it should stay with image. DeirYassin 16:23, 23 Apr 2005 (UTC)

But if a copyright holder shows up and says "delete!" isn't a webmaster obliged to delete rightaway? DarkSkywise 16:33, 23 Apr 2005 (UTC)

You seem to have released all copyright to it (calling it "copyright-free"), but are now trying to claim back that copyright that you don't seem to have any more. --SPUI (talk) 16:35, 23 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Text said "Created on October 8, 2001 in the Netherlands when somebody was in dire need of a (then) copyright-free drawing of a horse".

Notice "then". This does not ever mean that it isn't copyrighted or even trademarked NOW. I created it THEN so I could use it for somebody without any copyright hassles (because it's mine). That's all.

So where did I release copyright (which, under Dutch law, is only possible in writing anyway) or "try to claim it back"?

DarkSkywise 16:43, 23 Apr 2005 (UTC)

"Copyright-free" implies that you have given up copyrights to an image, in other words placed it literally or with an equivalent license into the public domain. It appears that instead you granted this person a license to use the image, while keeping copyright. Thus it was never "copyright-free", just released under a suitable license for that person's use of it.

Now when you uploaded it here, there was a notice that anything you submit is released under the GFDL. In practice, you don't seem to have realized this, and so you have probably not granted any license by uploading it.

Oh, and no lawyers in the hizzy. --SPUI (talk) 16:54, 23 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Oooo...kay... so what I probably should have said was "Somebody needed a drawing of a horse which she could use because I said she could"? ;-þ

DarkSkywise 17:09, 23 Apr 2005 (UTC)

• Delete, not clear how this image is notable. Martg76 17:18, 23 Apr 2005 (UTC)

I guess nobody's paying attention to the little fact *I* dont want the graphic here anymore either? Besides, it's not even on this part of Wikipedia anymore.

I guess I'll just have to wait until Horsie's more famouser, eh?

DarkSkywise 18:04, 23 Apr 2005 (UTC)

• Delete, not notable. DarkSkywise, assuming that was you, please read notices before you do anything to them. It says right on there: Please do not remove or deface this notice. android↔talk 21:12, Apr 23, 2005 (UTC)
• DarkSkywise, please do not "flood" the voting page, you get one vote and one vote only, regardless of whether or not you created the image/page yourself. However, if you wish to at any time change a vote please feel free to, in which case use the <s></s> tags on the old one to strikethru it, and then write the new one directly beside it, so people can clearly see which it was that you voted for, and which should be counted in the tally. Hope that helps you. Master Thief Garrett 22:36, 23 Apr 2005 (UTC)
• Delete; stickfigurecruft -- Infrogmation 22:40, 23 Apr 2005 (UTC)
• Delete, not a meme. RickK 22:44, Apr 23, 2005 (UTC)

'Delete'... It's stupid

'Keep' (unsigned, vote and poem added by Kezzie. Master Thief Garrett 12:08, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC))

It's so hard to believe that you want to delete
This stick-horse and his 'moo'.
That you want to be rid of his charming smile,
And his sheepish grin so blue.
Don't you know he's brought smiles to so many folks
Who have had a dismal day?
And he's travelled through cyberspace at speed
To bring joy in his unique way.
He's been dressed in the most elite of styles,
And looks great in an elegant suit,
And he's worn full bridal dress in church,
And a swaggie's gear, 'you beaut'!
He has travelled through cyberspace so much
That he's known right around the globe,
From New York down to Greece and right over to Aus,
Now he's surely no xenophobe.
He's been into the heart of green England's shores,
And across to the Isle of Wight,
And then travelled in space with the Stargate crew,
Through the darkest quartzite night.
One auspicious night when poor Rudolph was sick
He even pulled Santa Claus' sleigh,
But the thousands he's touched with his cute little moo
Will always remember him,
As the one who came by on the day they were sad
And were cheered by his moo and grin.

Your imperfect stab at rhyme and onomatopoeia doesn't exactly sway me. Close but no stickgar...

...and some would see this as flooding the vote page. I considered rv'ing it, but I'll leave that up to some other poor schmuck to take the blame... hehehe... Master Thief Garrett 12:08, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC)

REVIEW: Absolutely teriffic example of neo-Romantic Australian poetry, the underlaying methaphor nicely catching the onomatopoetic sub-structure of the tense dichotomy consisting within the basic rhythm and color of the general flow, while not losing touch with the ambivalent quasi-realistic balance of... er... of what the poem was about!

c'mon guys... it's just for a week... leave it on, okay? ;-)

DarkSkywise 12:33, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC)

ROFLOL - Hey... you expect something perfect on the spur of the moment at 10 pm on a Sunday night! :o Gee you're a hard tyrant!  ;) --Kezzie 12:36, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC)

on the other hand...

Now let's consider this... how would *you* rate an encyclopedia that only has stuff in it that you know? Not very high, methinks.

Okay, so there is this original first drawing of a character that may have about some 10,000 fans or so. Meaning, *you* probably don't know about it. Other people however, like the people who read about Horsie on fanfiction.net (who really loved the character) probably *would*.

So the original drawing was silly. You know, you're all absolutely right. It *is*. But would you be able to predict the whole future of the Disney empire by just looking at the first Mickey Mouse draft? Ever heard the story of that guy at Decca Records who thought guitar groups were a passing fad already?

Everybody please raise your hands if you've bothered to check the readers' reviews over at fanfiction.net. Or checked how *large* the two Internet forums were where you could find Horsie. No hands? Oh dear.

At least Master Thief Garrett finally *did* check out some of the Horsie links. And... *gasp* ...had a big chuckle doing so (I hope you don't mind me telling this... sorry).

No, Wikipedia isn't a crystall ball, it's true. Just don't put down the 10,000 ppl wordwide who *do* love Horsie and would've loved to see their hero on Wikipedia.

For copyright reasons, the graphic should go, yes (which most of the votes were about). But it's already gone, so let's concentrate on what's left and vote on whether potential Horsie-friends should be able to look up ol' Blue Manes here in Wiki-world.

peace,

DarkSkywise 06:45, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Nono, that's fine you telling that, no need to apologise, after all that page is fully public too, it's not like you're divulging something intentionally private... 100,100,000 people could have read that page by now for all we know!

The problem is, the Google count is abominably low, 40 (StickHorsie) + 98 (Stick Horsie) = 138. 138, I am sorry to say, doesn't make the cut.

Please understand this, it is not about the 10,000 people who support it, it's about the "big picture". This joke, in the eyes of the world, is NOTHING. It is minor and restricted to "fancruft" websites--FOR NOW. Once your book(s) is/are released and have huge popularity on Amazon.com and other such sources, THEN and ONLY THEN will we allow this to remain here. I am truly sorry, but, much like GANNON-BANNED, it's a joke where the fanbase thinks they're bigger and more valid than they really are. Please try to understand this, you are NOT famous enough yet, when you are, we will be proud to have an article about you and your efforts, even referring to this Vfd thread with pangs of guilt at how we deleted something that went on to be a huge hit.

But until then, it's gone I'm afraid... Master Thief Garrett 08:42, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC)

• Keep (just the article, mind you , which will probably be rewritten umpteen times until I'm sure about what would be appropriate in this case... it's far easier to write about other ppl's stuff anyway) ;-þ
  • NOTE: the italicised content above has been added by 80.57.233.10, which may or may not be DarkSkywise when he hasn't logged in. If you are not him, then this is vandalism/perversion of another's contribution. If you are him, please log in when editing your own comments so it doesn't look like they've been tampered with by someone else. Master Thief Garrett 08:28, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC)

DarkSkywise 06:47, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC)

no, it's me... did I get logged out again? :oS

that *was* one of the problems getting the image deleted... ppl thought I wasn't me, even tho' I never physically logged out

DarkSkywise 08:35, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Yes, I thought so... I seem to recall there being a "minutes to stay logged in" option... or maybe you could just stay logged in permanently if you're the only user of your computer. Master Thief Garrett 08:42, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Well, one comes and learns ;-P

Note to Andrew Lenahan - Starblind and other Googlers who found only a few Horsie graphics with Googling for "StickHorsie" (I explained why that didn't work somewhere earlier on this page)... try an image search with "groups horsie" which should yield a whole lot more! (Horsie mainly lived within MSN Groups territory for the first two years of its life)

and meanwhile... don't forget to have a coke and a smile! (<< Horsie graphic)

DarkSkywise 08:54, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC)

LOL! Maybe we should license a copy of him for Wikipedia:Wikistress... LOL! Master Thief Garrett 10:57, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC)

You're not turning into a Horsie fan, are you? ;oO

bytheway, I left you a note on your own page... the StickHorsie Hate Group (see? it's really famous!) apparently has found us & did a little defacing (probably without knowing it was logged) *sigh*

As for the licensing... I'm sure we can work something out ;-)

DarkSkywise 11:03, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC)

• keep

Zippy16 13:57, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC)

• Delete, nn. See also: concise. —Korath (Talk) 18:48, Apr 24, 2005 (UTC)

I would've been glad to expand it a little, but since it's going to be deleted anyway, I don't think that would be very useful. DarkSkywise 04:39, 26 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Since you asked, I was referring to your little filibuster here. —Korath (Talk) 08:14, Apr 26, 2005 (UTC)

• Keep

StickHorsie Rocks!!! Pepsi 22:38, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC)

• Strong delete as patent nonsense. — JIP | Talk 04:41, 25 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Define "patent nonsense" please? (especially since you seem to feel so strongly about it?) DarkSkywise 04:39, 26 Apr 2005 (UTC)

• • Please refer to Wikipedia:patent nonsense. Technically, this does seem to fall in that category. Master Thief Garrett 05:20, 26 Apr 2005 (UTC)
    • Since it isn't "text or random characters that has no assignable meaning at all" I assume it falls under "content so completely and irremediably confused that no intelligent person can be expected to try to make head or tail of it" then. Ummm... are you sure? :-/ DarkSkywise 00:29, 27 Apr 2005 (UTC)

• Strong delete. Also, Kill the Socks Radiant_* 10:59, Apr 25, 2005 (UTC)
  • Socks? Is one of these voters a (potential) sockpuppet? If so then I didn't notice... you should maybe elaborate on this, but not necessarily on here, maybe on "that other place"... Master Thief Garrett 11:56, 25 Apr 2005 (UTC)
    • Well, it is a horde of new or anon users suddenly appearing only to vote here. Whether they are friends of DarkSkywise from MSN Groups (as he claims, and I have no reason to doubt that) or actual duplicate accounts is irrelevant, per ArbCom ruling. This is explained in WP:SOCK. Radiant_* 13:12, Apr 25, 2005 (UTC)

Just don't KILL them, okay? :-/ DarkSkywise 04:39, 26 Apr 2005 (UTC)

done! (this is about "elaborating in an other place" DarkSkywise 04:39, 26 Apr 2005 (UTC))

bytheway, all people in favor of keeping the StickHorsie entry are established members of the US MSN Groups help site (which can be quite easily proven) so no false accusations please!

DarkSkywise 12:47, 25 Apr 2005 (UTC)

• not to detract from the purpose of this discussion but if the reference to sock was in relation to myself being a new user if wikipedia or a fake identity in any way I can assure you that it is a user name that I have used at MSN groups for 4+years and have never had call nor reason to become a member of wikipedia before Zippy16 21:00, 25 Apr 2005 (UTC)

And since the fat lady is already clearing her throat...

Okay, I got it now, no Wiki-entry for Horsie. Reasons being: fan base is too small, google count is too low, nothing officially published yet. I can live with that. Really.

Special thanks go to Kezzie, Zippy & Pepsi for expressing their honest opinions, my lawyer for only charging me two hours instead of the seven that we had each other "on hold" during the graphic-thingy-mess-up and Master Thief Garrett for at least actually & personally checking out some Horsie stuff AND having a chuckle (which is what Horsie is all about, really).

So let me finish with this nice, happy and touching Yes This Really Happened Horsie story...

One of the members of my personal website who didn't join because they knew *me* but to find out more about a certain blue equine, is a woman who (at that time) was suffering from an extreme case of agoraphobia. When she decided that she wanted to do something with her life again, this meant (among other things) getting a job. But that also meant getting outside, which was quite scary.

So it was advised she'd take something nice and friendly and familiar with her to give her some comfort while being out on the streets. She decided to bring a picture of StickHorsie, but because her printer was out of order, she put the picture on a floppy disk instead and went off. Apparently this helped, because she quite easliy made it to the office where she would have her first job interview in ages.

Since the job involved some confidential computer-related stuff, she was thouroughly searched at the entrance of the building and lo! what's this diskette, miss? a virus maybe, to disturb our systems? lemme check!

Now can you imagine the look on the security guard's face when he saw what actually was on the disk? (I can.)

Meanwhile, this woman recently got married and is now the proud mother of a bouncing baby boy. And guess what... the little tyke is already a Horsie addict too!

Okay, th-th-that's all folks! *waves loudly* (And don't forget to moo every once in a while.)

DarkSkywise 05:24, 26 Apr 2005 (UTC)

• Keep Seems I have errie timing.. as the above mentioned woman is me. I know none of ya'll will believe it but it happend. I actually have a picture of my son holding stickhorsie (an image made for me by one of the members of said group) hanging in his nursery. What on earth is wrong with wanting a little humor in this world of ours? StickHorsie has touched a lot of lives including my own, and now my family's. If anyone is so deadset thinking this is all coming from one person find a way to check ISP's and you will see that StickHorise has a fan base that covers the entire world.. I for one love him and his "moo" heard around the globe... ~* GR *~ GothicRose 19:09, 26 Apr 2005 (UTC)
  • This vote is the user's only contribution to Wikipedia so far
  • A link with a picture of li'l Luke holding Horsie was originally part of the story but was removed by Korath for being "a blatant attempt at Google bombing" which term I had to look up. Apparently, URLS of graphics stored at MSN look like very dangerous code to some. (Yes, they *are* far too long, but MSN image urls are *always* like that.) Am still waiting for further explanation from any of the editors. DarkSkywise 00:18, 27 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Question: as soon as Horsie will be famous enough to re-enter Wiki-space, what would be the best procedure to use an illustration without running the risk of losing all rights to the character itself? I don't have any real problems putting for instance a lower-quality pic with some of Horsie's escapades in the Public Domain (they can't really do much with something like that) but how would that affect my rights to "StickHorsie and all distinct likenesses thereof"? DarkSkywise 04:32, 27 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Still no explanation why I was being accused of "Google bombing"? DarkSkywise 17:42, 28 Apr 2005 (UTC)

• The MSN links. MSN links contain a whole heap of gobbledegook as you've seen, and there is more than one weird link generated, even if it links to the same page. Therefore you could potentially have far far more Google results than you "deserve" to have, but this is the fault of MSN rather than yourself... Master Thief Garrett 22:35, 28 Apr 2005 (UTC)
  • Apparently, it didn't help my Google count anyway (as you already know) ;-) DarkSkywise 01:46, 29 Apr 2005 (UTC)

The power of StickHorsie Well..since we are telling "StickHorsie" stories I might as well add mine. A very special friend of mine was very sick and thought to be dying. Now I've never flown before and I had always said that if you couldn't get there by driving I wouldn't be going. He lives in Australia and I live in Canada...and you can't get there from here without a plane. A few months before the members of the group made a recording of moos in honour of StickHorsie (I kid you not!) I burned this recording onto a CD and took it with me on my firstever flight and trip by myself! People who know me well, including my family, were very surprised by this as I am also extremely shy. Everytime I heard that recording I felt like I was not alone. That is the power of StickHorsie! I am planning another trip to Oz and that recording will be going with me again to keep me company on the long long flights.

This page is now preserved as an archive of the debate and, like some other VfD subpages, is no longer 'live'. Subsequent comments on the issue, the deletion, or the decision-making process should be placed on the relevant 'live' pages. Please do not edit this page.