Talk:Bert Williams

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Death[edit]

The article says "Williams collapsed on stage on February 25, 1922 whilst singing "Under The Bamboo Tree". Is there any citation for that? I know he did that song, but I also know that at the time he died he was appearing in a play of that name, and I suspect there may be some confusion here. -- Jmabel | Talk 23:10, Apr 23, 2005 (UTC) ==Legacy==lllllhis, please mention that Johnny Cash covered Williams' song "Nobody", because that's probably the best-known recent recording of one of his songs. -- Jmabel | Talk 23:13, Apr 23, 2005 (UTC)

Born 1874 or 1875?[edit]

He's listed under 1874 in music#Births but his birth year is given here as 1875 (and google searches, anyway, give a high number of hits for both years, but that says next to nothing.) Does anyone have a good source for either year? Thanks! Schissel : bowl listen July 3, 2005 18:11 (UTC)

Someone has now changed this, but still without citing a reference. - Jmabel | Talk 04:16, 11 March 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Early bio[edit]

According to the Caryl Phillips interview on the Diane Rehm show, his family lived briefly in Florida before moving to San Francisco. Also (though I don't have anything citable on this) I've heard his family lived briefly in NYC when he was a baby or toddler, then moved back to the West Indies. Does anybody have something solid & citable on that? -- Jmabel | Talk 08:24, 28 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]

in reference to his early bio......my paternal great grandfather, david jack born onthe island of barbuda and raised on the island of antigua was friends with bert williams during childhood.

however, in the 1880 us census,, the family is living in new york, new york. by 1899, bert gets married in new york. his family is listed in the census for 1900 in new york, and his father passes away around 1903. as a married person, he is listed in new york for 1910 and 1920. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 70.106.7.35 (talk • contribs) 15 June 2006.

That seems plausible. Does anyone have anything citable? -- Jmabel | Talk 21:59, 25 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

First paragraph of "Early Life" states his birth was in the Bahamas/Nassau, yet below his picture it says "Sweetes, Antigua". Which one is correct? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.50.196.228 (talk) 04:06, 12 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Quote discrepancy[edit]

This article has two different versions of the same WC Fields quote. "the funniest man I ever saw—and the saddest man I ever knew." and "Funniest man I ever saw, saddest man I ever knew." Which one is correct? Kevin143 06:28, 27 April 2006 (UTC)[reply]

African American[edit]

This series of edits removes all mention of "African American" because he was born in the West Indies. While "African American" in the narrowest sense would exclude that, it is still a pretty common designation for black people born in any English-speaking part of the Americas who immigrate as children and are reasonably assimilated to African American culture. Stokely Carmichael would be another good example. PBS, The Schomburg Institute, and The St. Petersburg Times Floridian all refer to Williams this way.

I'll allow a bit of time for a reply, rather than simply reverting. - Jmabel | Talk 21:20, 28 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Billing[edit]

It says, "In 1893, in San Francisco he formed the team of Williams and Walker, his partner being equally celebrated straight man George Walker."

Williams played the straight man. The straight man always got top billing. 75.36.151.35 (talk) 19:22, 26 March 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Possible copyright problem[edit]

This article has been revised as part of a large-scale clean-up project of multiple article copyright infringement. (See the investigation subpage) Earlier text must not be restored, unless it can be verified to be free of infringement. For legal reasons, Wikipedia cannot accept copyrighted text or images borrowed from other web sites or printed material; such additions must be deleted. Contributors may use sources as a source of information, but not as a source of sentences or phrases. Accordingly, the material may be rewritten, but only if it does not infringe on the copyright of the original or plagiarize from that source. Please see our guideline on non-free text for how to properly implement limited quotations of copyrighted text. Wikipedia takes copyright violations very seriously. Diannaa (talk) 00:05, 12 January 2015 (UTC)[reply]

External links modified[edit]

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Bahamian or American?[edit]

The prose indicates that Williams was a citizen of the Bahamas, but the categories indicate he was a US citizen. Which is the case? —C.Fred (talk) 17:48, 2 September 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I'm not sure it's the best source, but Williams & Walker traveled to England a couple of times. On their return on June 23, 1904, the manifest has the heading: "Nationality (Country of last residence)" where for Williams it is filled in as "U.S." The next column is "Race or People" and it is filled in as "West Indian Negro." - kosboot (talk) 23:58, 2 September 2020 (UTC)[reply]

He became a naturalized citizen of the US in 1918, but was a permanent resident from the age of 11 or 12. This accounts for his being categorized as American; he could also be added to [[Category:Bahamian male actors]].

Edit warriors have repeatedly changed the lead section to identify Williams as Bahamian rather than American; this seems contrary to MOS:ETHNICITY, which states; "The opening paragraph should usually provide context for the activities that made the person notable. In most modern-day cases, this will be the country of which the person is a citizen, national, or permanent resident; or, if the person is notable mainly for past events, the country where the person was a citizen, national, or permanent resident when the person became notable." When Bert Williams became notable, the context for his activities was the United States, and reliable sources identify him as American (e.g., see Britannica). Wikipedia describes him as a Bahamian-born American entertainer, which seems more informative than describing him as a Bahamian entertainer. He did not have his career in the Bahamas—after arriving in the US he never went back. Ewulp (talk) 02:10, 3 September 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for that, Ewlp. This happens on other bios like Chopin. I would suggest someone ask an admin to protect the page for a year and maybe a <rev> statement saying that the nationality should not be changed with out discussion on the talk page. - kosboot (talk) 13:22, 3 September 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Also a songwriter?[edit]

Was Bert Williams also a songwriter? If so, why isn't he credited as such in the current version of this article? It seems that he composed the music for Nobody (1905 song). 173.88.246.138 (talk) 02:07, 8 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

He composed a number of songs. Someone should mention that.