Talk:Kaʻiulani

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Surfing[edit]

This begs the curious question of what was considered proper surf attire in the 19th century? Even more so among women. I imagine in Hawaii, it was accepted for boys to wear lavalava loin cloths, and women wore .... what? 19th century expected swim attire of American women was full dresses with stockings in the water. That would not have been practical for the physical balancing required. I wonder how Kaiulani dressed for surfing? — Maile (talk) 22:29, 5 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]
It likely would have been full-body swimwear since her cousins wore neck-to-knee swimsuits made of wool or cotton in their 1890 surf. KAVEBEAR (talk) 04:12, 4 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

“She may have been the first female surfer in Britain, but the only tangible evidence – so far – is a letter in which she wrote that she enjoyed “being on the water again” at Brighton. She may have meant a walk on the West Pier, or a walk on the promenade. Ka’iulani liked swimming and surfing. She was a high-spirited girl, who when she returned to Hawaii, liked to sneak out past midnight to go swimming in the moonlight with girlfriends.”


Is it possible that Ka’iulani could have surfed in Britain? “We don’t know yet, is the honest answer,” says Robinson. “There’s a quote about her from when she was living in Brighton about how she loved being ‘on the water again’, and at the time Brighton was the sea-bathing capital of Britain, so there is a chance, but we haven’t found anything yet that proves it one way or the other. I like to think she did.” Ka’iulani might have surfed in Brighton or she might not, but Robinson is adamant that she never surfed on her visits north of the Border.

Did you know nomination[edit]

The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was: promoted by Amkgp (talk) 09:52, 24 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Princess Kaʻiulani, 1897
Princess Kaʻiulani, 1897
  • ... that Hawaiian princess Kaʻiulani (pictured) studied in England and was fluent in Hawaiian, English, French and German?
@Maile66: What do you think? KAVEBEAR (talk) 00:31, 2 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]
@KAVEBEAR: I agree that it's a little challenging to come up with a hook about her. — Maile (talk) 01:35, 2 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • ALT3:... that when princess Kaʻiulani (pictured) was five years old, her uncle King Kalākaua tried to arrange a marriage for her with a 13-year-old Japanese prince, but was turned down on behalf of the nation of Japan?
  • ALT4:... that when princess Kaʻiulani (pictured) died, her pet peacocks could be heard screaming in the night?
I think this one would be nice to include even if it is a "may have". KAVEBEAR (talk) 16:44, 2 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • ALT4a:... local lore has it that when princess Kaʻiulani (pictured) died, her pet peacocks could be heard screaming in the night? — Maile (talk) 17:15, 2 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Nancy Webb wrote it as "... people were startled from their sleep by a sudden wild screaming in the night. Kaiulani's peacocks were crying out their loss as if they consciously comprehended it." 1
Ellen Emerson White wrote about the shrieking as "it is also said ... " 2 — Maile (talk) 17:17, 2 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • ALT5:... that Hawaiian princess Kaʻiulani (pictured) was an avid surfer and may been the first female to surf in the British Isles in 1892?
I like the surfing angle. But maybe write it with the known facts (rather than "may have been"). Do we know that she took her surf board with her to the British Isles? I think I remember that somewhere. — Maile (talk) 17:15, 2 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Her surfing in England is a popular legend but only surf board is the one that her father donated to the museum after his death which was used only in Hawaii. KAVEBEAR (talk) 20:29, 2 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Added two more hooks about surfing and strikes other hooks. I think this is a more nuanced hook to use since it gives her more agency and focuses on a part of life not covered in popular telling of her life. KAVEBEAR (talk) 01:39, 10 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • ALT6:... that Hawaiian princess Kaʻiulani (pictured) was an avid surfer and professed in an interview, "I'm sure I was a seal in another world because I am so fond of the water"?
  • ALT7:... that Hawaiian princess Kaʻiulani (pictured) was an avid surfer and her seven foot alaia surfboard is one of the few to survive from the 19th-century?
ALT6 is my favorite of the surfing hooks, because it's so cute. We humans can relate to the thought , "... in another life, I must have been ..." — Maile (talk) 02:11, 10 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Improved to Good Article status by KAVEBEAR (talk) and Maile66 (talk). Nominated by KAVEBEAR (talk) at 00:30, 2 December 2020 (UTC).[reply]

  • Comment: "studied abroad in England" is awkward; use the more concise "studied in England" instead. Mindmatrix 00:45, 2 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Sure. It does make her sound like a 21st-century college student. KAVEBEAR (talk) 00:58, 2 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • GA received within 7 days of nomination. New enough, long enough, neutrally written, well referenced, no close paraphrasing seen. All images are freely licensed. QPQ done.
  • I also like ALT6 a lot; hook ref verified and cited inline. ALT7 is also verified and cited inline. I'd prefer something definite rather than iffy, so not approving ALT5. Good to go. Yoninah (talk) 23:10, 20 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Emma Nakuina, godmother[edit]

KAVEBEAR (talk) 10:14, 12 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Featured picture scheduled for POTD[edit]

Hello! This is to let editors know that File:Kaiulani in_1897,_wearing_pearl_necklace_(PPWD-15-3.016,_restored).jpg, a featured picture used in this article, has been selected as the English Wikipedia's picture of the day (POTD) for October 16, 2025. A preview of the POTD is displayed below and can be edited at Template:POTD/2025-10-16. For the greater benefit of readers, any potential improvements or maintenance that could benefit the quality of this article should be done before its scheduled appearance on the Main Page. If you have any concerns, please place a message at Wikipedia talk:Picture of the day. Thank you!  — Amakuru (talk) 11:01, 25 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Kaʻiulani

Kaʻiulani (Hawaiian pronunciation: [kə'ʔi.u.'lɐni]; Victoria Kawēkiu Kaʻiulani Lunalilo Kalaninuiahilapalapa Cleghorn; October 16, 1875 – March 6, 1899) was the only child of Princess Miriam Likelike, and the last heir apparent to the throne of the Hawaiian Kingdom. She was the niece of King Kalākaua and Queen Liliʻuokalani. After the death of her mother, Princess Kaʻiulani was sent to Europe at age 13 to complete her education under the guardianship of British businessman and Hawaiian sugar investor Theo H. Davies. She had not yet reached her eighteenth birthday when the 1893 overthrow of the Hawaiian Kingdom altered her life. The Provisional Government of Hawaii rejected pleas from both her father Archibald Scott Cleghorn, and provisional president Sanford B. Dole, to seat Kaʻiulani on the throne, conditional upon the abdication of Liliʻuokalani. The Queen thought the Kingdom's best chance at justice was to relinquish her power temporarily to the United States.

Photograph credit: unknown; restored by Mark Miller

Recently featured:

@Amakuru: Hello, this is one issue I have with the summary: "The Provisional Government of Hawaii rejected pleas from both her father Archibald Scott Cleghorn, and provisional president Sanford B. Dole, to seat Kaʻiulani on the throne, conditional upon the abdication of Liliʻuokalani." Can we change the emotionally charged wording of "pleas" to more a neutral wording of "suggestions"? It should also be the Committee of Safety because these conversations happen prior to the establishment of the PG. KAVEBEAR (talk) 06:42, 31 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]

I think changing the wording to be more neutral in this case may change the sense of urgency and true emotion of what was actually occurring. I believe the wording to be historically accurate. But what does the source itself impart? Is there that sense of urgency in how the content is written in the original source? If not then perhaps the content should be reviewed. Mark Miller (talk) 04:30, 2 February 2023 (UTC)[reply]
I think "proposal" is fine. I don't doubt Cleghorn's emotional investment, but using "pleas" would imply Dole had an emotional stake in the matter which from his memoir doesn't seem so. KAVEBEAR (talk) 07:19, 2 February 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Sister[edit]

in one of the sentences it says ka'iulani's niece (through her sister rose). ka'iulani had no siblings. 808Poiboy (talk) 02:41, 30 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

She had three older paternal half-sister and also a younger half-brother who was born after her death. KAVEBEAR (talk) 07:20, 6 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
ooooh.. I didn't know that. my apologies 808Poiboy (talk) 17:14, 6 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
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