Talk:Sovereign Base Area
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Is this really so? - Montréalais
- Sounds right to me. What's wrong with it? -- Tim Starling 01:08 3 Jul 2003 (UTC)
- I understood that the naval base was merely leased to the United States from Cuba. I guess I don't understand how that's different from, say, an embassy being leased to a foreign government. I don't think you could argue that Ottawa is Swiss-cheesed with tiny little embassy-sized pockets of "foreign" territory. - Montréalais
- My understanding is that embassies are part of the foreign state whilst in use. Canadian law would not apply in, say, the Saudi embassy. A famous British incident involved a police woman, Yvonne Fletcher being shot from the Libyan embassy in London. Noone was prosecuted, because the perpetrator was on Libyan soil and protected by diplomatic immunity jimfbleak 06:05 3 Jul 2003 (UTC)
- Under the Vienna Convention on Diplomatic Relations, embassies are not under the foreign state's jurisdiction, although the host nation needs official permission to physically enter them. It was the Libyan diplomats' status as diplomats that meant they could not be arrested, not where they committed their crimes. On the other hand, the Sovereign Base Areas are British territory. I couldn't find the relevent text of the 1960 treaty, but the British law implementing the treaty, the Cyprus Act 1960, states "The Republic of Cyprus shall comprise the entirety of the Island of Cyprus with the exception of the two areas defined as mentioned in the following subsection," namely Akrotiri and Dhekelia, over which "nothing in the foregoing section shall affect Her Majesty’s sovereignty or jurisdiction over those areas" (). They are thus unlike Guantanamo Bay, which is Cuban territory under US lease. 22.214.171.124 03:41, 31 May 2007 (UTC)
- I'm afraid you are all misunderstanding the status of the Sovereign Base Areas. In the case of Guantanamo Bay, the nation of Cuba existed and then Guantanamo Bay was leased to the US. The same does not apply to Cyprus. In the case of Cyprus, the whole island was, prior to Independence, a UK colony. At Independence the Republic of Cyprus was created, excluding those areas of the island that were retained by the UK. What is now the SBAs were UK territory before the Republic was created. Essentially, the SBAs have never been "Cypriot". —Preceding unsigned comment added by Sink Fleet (talk • contribs) 02:37, August 27, 2007 (UTC)
Akrotiri, the famous Minoan archaological site on Santorini, buried by the volcanic explosion of Thira--- now redirects here, because a minor UK base on Cyprus is also named "Akrotiri." Perhaps a disambiguation page would be in order? Wetman 00:22, 22 Aug 2004 (UTC)
The UK retained several militray bases throughout the Empire following decolonisation for a period of time eg Singapore, Simonstwon in South Africa etc? Were these sovereign bases? Astrotrain 20:51, 24 October 2005 (UTC)
I miss information as to why th UK is in Cyprus and perhaps more importantly why it doesn't leave. If Turkey has to give back a part of Cyprus, why is the UK exempt?
The confusion arises because of a misunderstanding of sovereignty. The UK occupy the Sovereign Bases legally because they were established through the international Treaty of Establishment. Turkey occupies the north of Cyprus illegally following a military invasion in 1974 of the Repuclic of Cyprus. The Republic of Cyprus was established also by the international Treaty of Establishment. --Sink Fleet (talk) 15:34, 8 November 2008 (UTC)
If we're debating this point (an activity seperate from editing this page), one argument is that the Turkish north was the result of an invasion of the Republic of Cyprus, while the SBAs were never part of independent Cyprus but holdovers from the British colony of Cyprus. And the Republic of Cyprus agreed to the SBAs in its treaty with Britain in 1960, while it never agreed to the invasion. 126.96.36.199 05:19, 31 May 2007 (UTC)
Are the SBAs parts of BOTs?
The Sovereign Base Areas are described as one of BOTs in the article British overseas territories. Is the British Government classifying SBA as a special type of BOT? If it is true, I think it should be explained in both British overseas territories and Sovereign Base Areas. ― 韓斌/Yes0song (談笑 筆跡 다지모) 14:55, 17 September 2007 (UTC)
It is not appropriate to refer to the Treaty Ports as "Sovereign Base Areas" etc. That terminology was NEVER used to describe them when the UK controlled them. Referring to them in that way is a "Wiki-invention" even if they were bases etc. The practical silliness of calling them a "Sovereign Base Area" also arises because at the time the UK occupied them, the UK's sovereign was the sovereign for all of Ireland. Admittedly, the UK did not administer Ireland at the time - only the treaty ports but Ireland had a Governor General and the UK sovereign was the sovereign. Ireland only ceased to be a British dominion in 1949. This is silly use of terminology with no historic or academic pedigree. Basically just made up. The Treaty Ports were never referred to as "Sovereign Base Areas" during the period the UK occupied them. 188.8.131.52 (talk) 11:35, 3 December 2011 (UTC)
- I think the argument relating to sovereignty may be more nebulous than you assert. However, I agree that referring to the Treaty Ports as "Sovereign Base Areas" is inappropriate unless a suitable source can be provided for doing so. In fact, I rather suspect we have here a variant on the myth that embassies are "foreign territory". Besides anything else, if the port areas weren't part of the Irish state's jurisdiction, the original Article 3 of Bunreacht na hÉireann would mean that Acts of the Oireachtas didn't extend to the port areas; and I can see no Act passed in 1938 to extend that jurisdiction to the reacquired territory! Andrew Gwilliam (talk) 00:48, 9 December 2011 (UTC).
The term "Sovereign Base" is the official one in use, even on the military maps. The Irish treaty ports were never deemed such. They are under UK sovereignty (regardless of whethe there is a monarch or not) as that is the way they were set up. Perhaps we learned from the Irish model. Acorn897 (talk) 18:16, 27 July 2012 (UTC)
Is anything happening with this? The closer seems to have abandoned his own suggestion... SalopianJames (talk) 14:57, 9 March 2013 (UTC) I have just tried editing this page, to make it about what it says it is about - "Sovereign Base Areas", which are Areas, not Bases (there are several military bases contained within the SBAs, but the SBAs themselves spread much wider and are a British Overseas Territory, not just an overseas base of the British armed forces). I have done this as an alternative to what really should happen, which is that this page should be scrapped altogether, with anything that it contains that does not duplicate the Akrotiri and Dhekelia page being moved over to there. The point is that "Sovereign Base Area" just is not a generic term - there only ever has been one pair and only ever will be - it is just a label dreamed up in 1960 for the one-off arrangements in Cyprus. Having this as a separate page is like treating "United States" or "United Kingdom" as if they were separate generic terms which each happened to have just one example (USA and UK-GBNI) - there is just no point in it. The continued survival of this page is due to whichever Wikipedia editor originally suggested that the Irish Treaty Ports should somehow also be thought of as SBAs (even though the term was never used for them - at least this has now been dropped on Wikipedia), and then to people who assume there must be such a thing as a notable concept of a "Sovereign Base Area" just because the term is used (but in the plural) in one single solitary case of an unfortunately cumbersome name "the Sovereign Base Areas of Akrotiri and Dhekelia on Cyprus". Whether or not Kevin Rutherford is going to get around to splitting Akrotiri/Western SBA from Dhekelia/Eastern SBA (or leave them together), the issue is that this page is entirely bogus in suggesting that there is any general concept of an SBA outside of the pair that form one British Overseas Territory on the island of Cyprus. Can we just agree to scrap this page? Waldronfan (talk) 00:47, 16 June 2013 (UTC)