Talk:Ancient Greece

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Classical Greece and Rome Top‑importance

	This article is within the scope of WikiProject Classical Greece and Rome, a group of contributors interested in Wikipedia's articles on classics. If you would like to join the WikiProject or learn how to contribute, please see our project page. If you need assistance from a classicist, please see our talk page.Classical Greece and RomeWikipedia:WikiProject Classical Greece and RomeTemplate:WikiProject Classical Greece and RomeClassical Greece and Rome articles
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Greece Top‑importance

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European history High‑importance

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Former countries

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History High‑importance

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§Empires, kingdoms and regions[edit]

Every time I look at this article, I question what the section on §Empires, kingdoms and regions adds to this article. It's a pretty random collection of polities (despite the name, there are no "regions" included) with no clear inclusion criteria, listing some very minor kingdoms which have no place in a wikipedia article on a topic as broad as ancient Greece (Dayuan, seriously?); including some weird overlaps (the kingdom of Macedon is listed as lasting until 146 BC, but the Antigonid dynasty, who ruled Macedon for the last part of that, is listed separately); and having strange omissions (why is the Delian League listed but the Peloponnesian League not?

Really, the major players should be (and in many cases already are!) discussed in §History, §Geography, and §Politics and society. Given that this entire section is completely uncited, I would suggest getting rid of the entire §Empires, kingdoms and regions section and its 14 variably helpful maps. This frees up 1500 words which would be much better spent on virtually anything else – we currently have fewer than 150 words on the legacy of ancient Greece(!), even less on the economy, barely a mention of Greek pottery or vase-painting, and only a single mention of women in the entire text. Caeciliusinhorto-public (talk) 09:07, 28 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]

@Caeciliusinhorto-public:, WP:BEBOLD. I agree, and I have done so.~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 03:53, 18 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

"... led by three hundred Spartans..." links to the movie...?[edit]

Does that link really need to be there? It honestly seems comedic. 12.175.28.210 (talk) 21:13, 7 December 2022 (UTC)[reply]

No, it doesn't need to be there, and I have removed it as unhelpful. Thanks for pointing it out Caeciliusinhorto (talk) 21:59, 7 December 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Confused scope[edit]

This page appears to miss the plot in ascribing the timeline of "ancient Greece" as continuing up until 600AD. That's not ancient anything. It's past classical and late antiquity and well on into the Middle Ages, which start in the late 5th century. In the Timeline of Ancient Greece, the timeline stops at the Battle of Corinth (146 BC), which saw the defeat of the Greek city states by the Roman republic and thus ushered in the Greco-Roman period. Other sources draw the line of ancient Greece even earlier, Britannia at 323BCE, with the death of Alexander. Iskandar323 (talk) 07:36, 29 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Have you tried to read the article? Not sure why you're confused. This is part of Ancient history. "Ancient Greece" continues until "Medieval Greece". There are many sub-periods - the major ones being Archaic Greece, Classical Greece, Hellenistic Greece and Roman Greece. 323 BCE is the customary date for the end of "Classical Greece", and the beginning of "Hellenistic Greece". 146 BCE is simply another customary transition date, from Macedonian-occupied Greece to Roman-occupied Greece. They're all still "Ancient Greece". I have no idea why the Wikipedia's timeline article stops at 146 BCE. My guess it is editor got exhausted, lost interest or decided the subsequent events timeline is already contained in the Roman timeline, so wasn't worth replicating. The only question is the transition from "Roman Greece" (Ancient) to "Byzantine Greece" (Medieval). Some date it as early as c.500 CE some as late as c.600 CE, it really depends on how you think of Justinian. While some historians think of him as the "first Byzantine", others see him as the "last Ancient", and prefer Heraclius as the "first Byzantine". c.600 is an approximate date that is closer to the latter interpretation. But you can think of the entire 6th Century as a transition period. Walrasiad (talk) 11:09, 29 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Ok, the Encyclopedia of Ancient Greece covers this. The timeline/Britannica are the issue. Iskandar323 (talk) 12:12, 29 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]

"It's past classical and late antiquity and well on into the Middle Ages, which start in the late 5th century." What are you talking about? The article on late antiquity specifies that the period lasts until "the early Muslim conquests (622–750)", and "the establishment of the later 7th century Umayyad Caliphate, generally marks the end of late antiquity." The 5th, 6th, and 7th category are all part of late antiquity. Dimadick (talk) 18:27, 30 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]